Comments on: Webb-Miller Chat http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/ theology. church. culture. life. Thu, 09 Sep 2010 03:23:32 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: David http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1804 David Wed, 12 Apr 2006 19:38:28 +0000 http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1804 I downloaded the podcast of the Webb/Miller interview a few days ago via itunes and listened while I was working late one night. I have been a fan of Derek's for a long time and recently read both Blue Like Jazz and Searching for God Knows What. I am in my late thirties and have been a believer since early childhood - raised by parents who put a high value on both good theology and service for God's kingdom. I also believe that I have a good understanding of Biblical truth and error. What I appreciate about both Webb and Miller is their approach to taking God's word seriously, their struggle to work out their faith, and their willingness to do some of this in a public forum. I wish that all Christian leaders were as vulnerable and ready to learn from God rather than finding contentment in formulas and traditions of men. I have found myself challenged by Webb and Miller to reconsider my approach to living out my faith in different ways. I think much of what Webb has to say is an attempt to convince fallen people that "yes, indeed they are lost and fallen" but that their fallen state is a beginning and not an end - that only Jesus can redeem them and should be their source of hope. This is always something that I need reminding about. Miller on the other hand is great at giving you a "day in the life" insight to his struggles and the miracle that God continues to work with him (and the rest of us) to redeem Miller's life and draw him to a greater dependence on him. I find Miller's candidness and irreverence mostly refreshing but at times disappointing because it often leaves me feeling unresolved. Maybe that’s not a bad thing but I wonder sometimes if Miller enjoys rocking the boat for the sake of his own amusement and without the best of intentions. As for the interview, I thought both men presented themselves as very thoughtful Christians who are trying hard to interpret scripture without the influence of culture and man-made institutions. Because of the way both men challenge traditional thinking in their work they are easy targets for religious traditionalists who want to discredit them by picking and choosing quotes. I think it’s fair to give both Miller and Webb a measure of grace in their means of expression and appreciate the broader picture that they both paint of our desperate need for renewal, repentance and revival in our thinking and our hearts. I downloaded the podcast of the Webb/Miller interview a few days ago via itunes and listened while I was working late one night. I have been a fan of Derek’s for a long time and recently read both Blue Like Jazz and Searching for God Knows What. I am in my late thirties and have been a believer since early childhood – raised by parents who put a high value on both good theology and service for God’s kingdom. I also believe that I have a good understanding of Biblical truth and error. What I appreciate about both Webb and Miller is their approach to taking God’s word seriously, their struggle to work out their faith, and their willingness to do some of this in a public forum. I wish that all Christian leaders were as vulnerable and ready to learn from God rather than finding contentment in formulas and traditions of men. I have found myself challenged by Webb and Miller to reconsider my approach to living out my faith in different ways. I think much of what Webb has to say is an attempt to convince fallen people that “yes, indeed they are lost and fallen” but that their fallen state is a beginning and not an end – that only Jesus can redeem them and should be their source of hope. This is always something that I need reminding about. Miller on the other hand is great at giving you a “day in the life” insight to his struggles and the miracle that God continues to work with him (and the rest of us) to redeem Miller’s life and draw him to a greater dependence on him. I find Miller’s candidness and irreverence mostly refreshing but at times disappointing because it often leaves me feeling unresolved. Maybe that’s not a bad thing but I wonder sometimes if Miller enjoys rocking the boat for the sake of his own amusement and without the best of intentions. As for the interview, I thought both men presented themselves as very thoughtful Christians who are trying hard to interpret scripture without the influence of culture and man-made institutions. Because of the way both men challenge traditional thinking in their work they are easy targets for religious traditionalists who want to discredit them by picking and choosing quotes. I think it’s fair to give both Miller and Webb a measure of grace in their means of expression and appreciate the broader picture that they both paint of our desperate need for renewal, repentance and revival in our thinking and our hearts.

]]> By: Sean http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1803 Sean Fri, 17 Mar 2006 16:57:12 +0000 http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1803 You think there's any chance Webb might add, "Don't teach me how to read with discernment, just hand me an authorized book list," to his song "New Law?" Moore has forgotten that Judge Paul Pressler didn't look at the first hill he saw and said, "I want to die on that one!" The fight to reform the SBC was a noble fight. Even though I'm not a Southern Baptist, I personally benefited from the hard work and sacrifices made by Pressler, Mohler, Paterson, and others because I went to SBTS. Yet, I was warned before I went that some warriors are always looking for the next fight behind every clump of dirt. Sadly Moore appears to be going this route by looking for battles with everyone who doesn't look and sound just like him (unless that person is the late Johnny Cash?). I'm grateful for the varied work of Miller, Moore, and Webb (I mean c'mon Derek, paedobaptism?) but I certainly don't agree with them 100% of the time. Perhaps it's time for Moore to slowly put his claymore back in its scabbard and openly acknowledge that a guy like Miller may have something to say to worth hearing. You think there’s any chance Webb might add, “Don’t teach me how to read with discernment, just hand me an authorized book list,” to his song “New Law?”
Moore has forgotten that Judge Paul Pressler didn’t look at the first hill he saw and said, “I want to die on that one!” The fight to reform the SBC was a noble fight. Even though I’m not a Southern Baptist, I personally benefited from the hard work and sacrifices made by Pressler, Mohler, Paterson, and others because I went to SBTS. Yet, I was warned before I went that some warriors are always looking for the next fight behind every clump of dirt. Sadly Moore appears to be going this route by looking for battles with everyone who doesn’t look and sound just like him (unless that person is the late Johnny Cash?).
I’m grateful for the varied work of Miller, Moore, and Webb (I mean c’mon Derek, paedobaptism?) but I certainly don’t agree with them 100% of the time. Perhaps it’s time for Moore to slowly put his claymore back in its scabbard and openly acknowledge that a guy like Miller may have something to say to worth hearing.

]]> By: Seth http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1802 Seth Thu, 16 Mar 2006 17:22:47 +0000 http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1802 Very nice review, I missed the interview/webchat so it was nice to read a summarized version of it. Very nice review, I missed the interview/webchat so it was nice to read a summarized version of it.

]]> By: James http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1801 James Thu, 16 Mar 2006 16:40:15 +0000 http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1801 Thanks, Joe. Thanks, Joe.

]]> By: Joe Thorn http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1800 Joe Thorn Thu, 16 Mar 2006 15:21:28 +0000 http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1800 Derek made the distinction without elabroation, saying that we should "fight" but not kill. He also said "violence is not one of our resources." So the "fight" isn't a physical combat. It is the active, aggressive work to protect, defend, rescue or relieve. I think Derek would say the Bible calls us to fight/war, but not as the world does. Not by killing , but in working against evil via peace and righteousness. Derek made the distinction without elabroation, saying that we should “fight” but not kill. He also said “violence is not one of our resources.” So the “fight” isn’t a physical combat. It is the active, aggressive work to protect, defend, rescue or relieve. I think Derek would say the Bible calls us to fight/war, but not as the world does. Not by killing , but in working against evil via peace and righteousness.

]]> By: James http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1799 James Thu, 16 Mar 2006 08:16:37 +0000 http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1799 I enjoyed the audio and this review. Would someone please comment on the statements made regarding fighting vs. killing. It provoked me to think about the difference but then I wondered if there was a difference, biblically speaking. I enjoyed the audio and this review.

Would someone please comment on the statements made regarding fighting vs. killing. It provoked me to think about the difference but then I wondered if there was a difference, biblically speaking.

]]> By: Tim Etherington http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1798 Tim Etherington Thu, 16 Mar 2006 03:37:26 +0000 http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1798 Good summary Joe. I caught parts of it live and then there was a "live blogging" kind of thing going on at the Webboard. I'm pretty sure Don Miller and Dizzy Gillespie were seperated at birth. I was glad to hear Derek affirm that "maybe" it is right for a country to go to war to protect the innocent. I was afraid he was going to say no. I agree with the maybe and I thought they were correct in saying that if we are going to invade a country to liberate its people from a dictator, there were other countries in the world that needed it before Iraq. The moderator ruined it for me. He was late and then he never seemed to arrive. He asked pretty much the same question each time. Now I'm going to have to read Don Miller this summer. Good summary Joe. I caught parts of it live and then there was a “live blogging” kind of thing going on at the Webboard.

I’m pretty sure Don Miller and Dizzy Gillespie were seperated at birth.

I was glad to hear Derek affirm that “maybe” it is right for a country to go to war to protect the innocent. I was afraid he was going to say no. I agree with the maybe and I thought they were correct in saying that if we are going to invade a country to liberate its people from a dictator, there were other countries in the world that needed it before Iraq.

The moderator ruined it for me. He was late and then he never seemed to arrive. He asked pretty much the same question each time.

Now I’m going to have to read Don Miller this summer.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1797 Anonymous Wed, 15 Mar 2006 22:16:04 +0000 http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1797 <strong>Summary of Donald Miller/Derek Webb webchat</strong> Provided by Joe Thorn. Summary of Donald Miller/Derek Webb webchat

Provided by Joe Thorn.

]]> By: Scott Zeller’s Blog » Webb/Miller Chat http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1796 Scott Zeller’s Blog » Webb/Miller Chat Wed, 15 Mar 2006 20:55:25 +0000 http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1796 [...] If you don’t want to listen to the whole thing - of even if you do - Joe Thorn has posted an insightful and descriptive summary. The men did not come off as whiny liberals who are only trying to fight against authority. They came off as men who are trying to think their way through Scripture as they follow Jesus into the world. Their basic theology is evangelical with some Reformed hat-tipping. Even if you disagree with them, they just aren’t what they are painted to be by some of the critics. [...] [...] If you don’t want to listen to the whole thing – of even if you do – Joe Thorn has posted an insightful and descriptive summary. The men did not come off as whiny liberals who are only trying to fight against authority. They came off as men who are trying to think their way through Scripture as they follow Jesus into the world. Their basic theology is evangelical with some Reformed hat-tipping. Even if you disagree with them, they just aren’t what they are painted to be by some of the critics. [...]

]]> By: Michael http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1795 Michael Wed, 15 Mar 2006 20:23:24 +0000 http://www.joethorn.net/2006/03/15/webb-miller-chat/#comment-1795 Joe, Thanks. I really don't have the time to listen to the chat but I did have the time to read this. I really appreciate your summary! Joe, Thanks. I really don’t have the time to listen to the chat but I did have the time to read this. I really appreciate your summary!

]]>